Pro-troops and anti-war

[sarahmichigan]

I'm copying the following over from comments in a friend's LJ because a comment replying to my comment was deleted, and I couldn't reply to it there. What started the exchange was that my friend wrote on her LJ that she'd been made uncomfortable about her own views and liberalism after talking to a conservative, pro-military friend who is stationed overseas.

I said:

I'm pro the troops, and liberal, and anti-war.

One of my brothers saw combat, 1st Division Marines, in the first Persian Gulf War. A war I demonstrated against.

My other brother is career military and spent some time as a peace-keeper in Kosovo.

Nobody better EVER accuse me of being against the military or against the troops. I'm pro-troops, just anti- the way the gov't uses them. I want them all to come home safely.

He said:

Subject: Pro-troops but anti use
That's like saying your pro-paint but anti-paintbrush. Except by sending them to war, how else can the government use troops?

If he hadn't deleted his comment, I would have replied:

How about for defense only?

Actually, my anti-war, non-interventionist sentiments aren't quite that black and white. I'm pretty glad the US got involved in World War II because, despite dropping the bomb on Japan, I think that on balance, we did the right thing to intervene in that conflict. But I almost never approve of the way our government uses the troops in modern times, sticking our noses in where it's not wanted or needed, being the World Police. I think there's a difference between starting a war of aggression and joining an ally in a war of defense, and lots of shades of gray in between.

Comments

[bernmarx.livejournal.com]

I'm with Bill Maher. He's been consistent about pointing out that he and many liberals* fully supported the US's aggression against Afghanistan. I'm anti-war, but I support it when it is needed, and there ARE conditions where it's needed. Aggression was needed in Afghanistan. It was not needed in Iraq.

To use a different analogy, vegetarians are anti-meat, but any that own cats are aware hopefully aware that cats NEED meat. For a vegetarian to be anti-meat but feed their cats meat isn't hypocritical, it's sensible.

* Deliberately phrased this way, since I'm not sure if he identifies as liberal

[blergeatkitty.livejournal.com]

Maybe I AM pro-paint but anti-paintbrush. Hell, it worked for Jackson Pollock.

[sarahmichigan.livejournal.com]

*snorf

[theal8r.livejournal.com]

I suspect he deleted it because he: knew it would be inflammatory, or decided there were ways to be anti-use but pro-military. It could also be that he decided it was an argument he just didn't want to have. He's the friend in Korea, btw.

It wasn't that I was uncomfortable with my views, but that I was uncomfortably aware, through his prodding, of inconsitencies in my views, and areas in which I had grown complacent with my views which left me with knee-jerk reactions rather than reasoned ones. This could also be part of what inspired hog to erase his post -- that he felt it was more knee-jerk than reasoned. I find it uncomfortable to be a liberal in the part of the country where I live (SW rural Michigan), and to be patriotic in this part of America.

[sarahmichigan.livejournal.com]

Like juniperus said, it's probably a good conversation if it made you uncomfortable. I don't mind having inconsistencies in my views pointed out to me. I think that, sometimes, I over-simplify my views when trying to explain things on-line, and that sometimes leads to accusations of inconsistency that aren't entirely with merit, though.

[theal8r.livejournal.com]

I do that, too. Trying to be brief.

[mogwar.livejournal.com]

I've been there, too. I was living on a military base near the organization point for all troops headed to the middle east for Desert Shield/Storm when I protested that war. My father is career military and supported our combat operations in Bosnia for a year, while my mother and siblings and I stayed in the US. I'm very supportive of our troops - almost all of the adult men I knew growing up where members of the military. But I do not support this war (or most others).